I do think that the main difference between this arc and the chasms we saw between House and Wilson in the Tritter arc is that this time they are being forced to consider what their friendship means to them beyond the surface issues. Wilson will be forced to look at House beyond the neediness/enabling level, while House will see what is missing beyond the three issues that Kutner rattled off and the epiphany. If House can find replacements for those elements, but still is missing Wilson, then it's obviously the person and not the physical wants that he are essential to him. What we're starting to see here is a House that is at a loss, and just beginning to define what it is that's really missing.
One other quick thought. I haven't had time to do a rewatch, but I found it interesting that when Apple was describing how the world was ugly, so she left architecture and went into teaching math, she pointed to similarities in her global outlook to House's misanthropy in connection to his leg. I think that House's reply, that he hasn't given up yet, is key to understanding what lies beneath the surface -- just like those glimpses of humanity that we see on occasion, that he still has a glimmer of hope despite everything he's seen and experienced.
Word to your whole post, Namaste! Particularly the last paragraph. House hasn't given up, he does still have a glimmer of hope.
It sort of reminds me of the idea that if you really, truly want something, you fight for it. I think he's decided to fight for this friendship and hopefully Wilson will see that.
Poeia- 09-24-2008
On a totally unrelated note, I was very annoyed when House said you don't need consent for an autopsy. I'm no expert, but I'm sure it IS needed. I know I'm probably being petty and nit-picky here but that one really bothered me.
If a patient died from unknown causes the Medical Examiner can demand an autopsy. In a case like this when the cause seems to be contagious, it's almost automatic to do one.
I'm sure there is an appeal process if the family doesn't want an autopsy and I'm not sure why House wasn't able to get one for Esther (All In). If authorities weren't able to get autopsies without spousal consent, there would be many more undetected poisonings.
travlncarrie- 09-24-2008
Did anyone else catch the bit when House said (to O'Shea) that he was taking vicodin AND opioids? Isn't vicodin...hydrocodone? I thought hydrocodone was an opioid, so does that mean he's taking more than one? And b12? For brain function, I wonder?
filex1410- 09-24-2008
I'm not sure that was meant to be literal, just a -*test*-('") to see if O'Shay would get on his case about his drug comsumption the way Wilson use to. O'Shay's non reaction was what prompted House to say, "I think I'm falling in love." :lol:
travlncarrie- 09-24-2008
I'm not sure that was meant to be literal, just a -*test*-('") to see if O'Shay would get on his case about his drug comsumption the way Wilson use to. O'Shay's non reaction was what prompted House to say, "I think I'm falling in love." :lol:
I know, I just thought it was weird that he said he was taking both vicodin and opioids (which was plural if I remember right)...he could have just said three or four vicodin for the same result. throwing in the b12 was good...it's used for brain function (if I remember right).
filex1410- 09-24-2008
I guess Houes was just laying it on thick. Being specific about the Vicodin (perhaps that is already known on the PPTH grapevine) and more generic (hee) by adding opiods (it was plural) to make the most extreme case possible for objection by another doctor. But a doctor that didn't care about him, not even professionally, didn't care about it to even ask further.
The B-12 was like the pillow to cushion the blow of all the other stuff. :)
NightOwl- 09-24-2008
Well some new viewers may not have seen S2. Regardless whatever other secrets Wilson may or may not have, and who doesn't have secrets, I doubt any other would be more devastating to him if House were to reveal it. This particular one could cost Wilson his career.
I generally operate under the theory that most members here have watched every episode, and if they haven't yet, they are probably planning to. If someone doesn't know something about the show, they ask. I can't be responsible for pointing out every single instance of X whenever I happen to mention examples of X that I don't know about because the show hasn't revealed them. If that were the case on this board, then almost every post would be book-length.
Anyway, I wasn't trying to figure out which secret would be THE MOST devastating to Wilson's career; I was simply expressing a desire to know all his secrets. Because Wilson is mysterious, and I like him. Mainly, that line about secrets was meant to indicate intimacy between House and Wilson. Close friends know each other's secrets. That's all. And I was expressing excitement over that.
Moving on.
Poeia and ikilledkenny: I was slightly annoyed at the reference to not needing consent for the autopsy as well, because in House Training, Wilson had to get consent from Lupe's grandparents for the autopsy. But I resolved it the way Poeia did: The patient died of an unknown cause as part of a pattern with other patients, so it was like a public-health issue.
bailey- 09-24-2008
This show is so schizophrenic these days that it's difficult for me to evaluate episodes. There were a few things that I really, really liked last night and a few others that are further demonstration of a sinking hole that's dragging the show down.
What I loved:
All of Hugh's expressions. He just looked like a beaten dog at times, trying to please his master while remaining true to himself. The scene at Wilson's door where he asks "How are you?" Heart breaking stuff. Equally effective was the scene with Penny-Apple the POTW who told him he looked sad. Just a little twitch of the lip.
I liked that House was actually involved with the POTW this time. Seems like it's been awhile since that happened. Personally, I get more of those parallels between House and the patient than I do of any anvil dropped between House and 13. Those parallels, such as they are, do not work in any way for me.
House and Dr. O'Shea. Frankly, I would rather see House continue to pursue THAT relationship for episodes on end. It had potential, both comic and dramatic.
I thought the intro was great. Very unique, very clever, very well shot.
What I liked:
I probably would have liked the PI more if he'd been on a different show. He and Hugh clicked but their clicking managed to pull House out of House, not pull Lucas the PI into House. (If that makes sense.) I also thought his list of quirks was just way too deliberate. "That's how I sneeze." Seems like such a blatant set up for a future scene. (Or otherwise useless information.)
But I didn't hate the PI even though others clearly have. I could do without him, though. I thought it was a wasted opportunity to further integrate marginalized characters. Make them all go crazy being House's go-to "friend" while he is dealing with Wilson. They'd all be so beside themselves, they'd be begging Wilson to come back, too.
What I didn't like:
I think it must be infecting all writers at this point. Even Kaplow isn't able to rise above it, but scenes with the new characters never work because truly they are all just spouting lines at each other. None of them have any conflict or underlying tensions between each other. None of them have recognizable alliances. They don't seem plausible as a team and their exchanges are all very surface level. They are literally weak plot points and not recognizable characters. Kutner had a quip about how Wilson loaned House money, liked Monster Trucks and was House's conscience. That's all well and good but it rings utterly false coming from Kutner. Unlike season 1 of the show, we never see Wilson interacting with the new team. Aside from Wilson dating Amber (and taking over the case in 97 seconds when House shocked himself) there is no cross-over between characters.
Out of mercy, perhaps, the ducklings just completely dropped out of the picture with about 15 minutes to go. Frankly, the show is better that way, but it did serve to highlight how useless they are as characters.
I wasn't sure what was happening medically but I'm not sure there was much plausibility to it to begin with so maybe it doesn't matter. Despite being intrigued by the intro hook, as the "mystery" wore on, I found I didn't much care.
My initial fears of how episodes would look when they put all their eggs in one storytelling basket has come true. Many people clamor for nothing but House/Wilson or House/Cuddy or House/Whatever, but IMO, an over emphasis on one over the other just doesn't work. House/Wilson has received a lionshare of emphasis over the last season and this current arc but as enjoyable as HL and RSL are together, there is a plausible storytelling limit. Their arc might work better for me if I could be engaged in the scenes that don't feature them as well, but right now, that's just a big ball of suck.
I guess, in short, fully enjoyable episodes are a thing of the past.
Hugh_lover- 09-24-2008
I loved this episode, and enjoyed it from beginning to end. To me this episode had a classic, season one feel about it. For several reasons:
-- House is directly involved with the patient and the DDX. (All we need now is to get the white board back, scenes which were always great for House snarkiness and brilliance).
---House's quiet relationship/talks with the patient harkens back to shows like the Pilot, Control, Damned If You Do, Babies & Bathwater, and Kids, not to mention Autopsy and several 2nd season shows. House may not like patients, but he is honest with them and can talk to them without verbally abusing them. It's been awhile since we've since House like this. I can't recall any of these moments in season 4, except for Frozen.
---the P.I. (to House) was Wilson circa season one, when Wilson was not as complex as he is now, but was a more moralizing figure for House. The P.I. worked for me because we need someone to confront House about how he is handling the Wilson situation. As far as I'm concerned, none of the characters new or old are in a situation with House where they could do this believably. House doesn't confide in any of them. The P.I. is a nice short term solution. Plus, House paying for a friend....it just so fits the character. Right now, the P.I. guy is working for me.
---House's annoying, childish behavior towards the nurse - shades of Evil Nurse Brenda - that was great. I guess we're not getting ENB back, but I'll take it. That was fun. Houseian kind of fun.
---Season one Cuddy is back! Ha. Ha. I loved that.
---I liked the medical mystery. I'm not a doctor and don't watch the show for its medical mystery or realism, basically the mystery is just an opportunity to delve into the character of House and his relationships. It did that.
Still need to fix
---House's relationship with his cottages.
He's too nice to them. Seriously, he was a nasty piece of work with C-F-C. Remember when he bounced the ball off the back of Chase's head? He always mocked Cameron, and always, always got into Foreman's head. My problem with the cottages right now does not have to do with any one individual, I actually think they're fine, but they all seem too relaxed around House. He isn't mocking their theories, telling them what idiots or how useless they are, putting barriers in front them to see how they react, sending them off to the clinic....they need some conflict here and right now there isn't any.
---House in the clinic?
I'm starting to think I'm going to really like season 5. Right now they need to tie up the loose ends of season 4, but once Wilson comes back and we lose the P.I. I'm hoping things will settle down and we'll get back to House in the clinic, annoying the nurses, annoying Cuddy, his snarkiness in the DDX and with his cottages, and hopefully, a repaired relationship with Wilson.
I like Chase where he is (Oh yeah, and House watching the surgery overhead while annoying the surgeon and Chase, another classic House moment). I definitely see the possibilities of keeping Chase in surgery and becoming House's "bitch" again.
And while I've never dis-liked Cameron, I also never miss her when she's not in an episode, which was the case again.
Namaste- 09-24-2008
---House's quiet relationship/talks with the patient harkens back to shows like the Pilot, Control, Damned If You Do, Babies & Bathwater, and Kids, not to mention Autopsy and several 2nd season shows. House may not like patients, but he is honest with them and can talk to them without verbally abusing them. It's been awhile since we've since House like this. I can't recall any of these moments in season 4, except for Frozen.
I'd say that both "Ugly" and "Guardian Angels" have those moments off hand.
And, by the way, speaking of ugly, I really appreciated the ugliness of Apple's lying to try and get the other patient to have a brain biopsy. It was nasty, it was selfish, and it was absolutely what I think would happen when people are scared they're going to die.
Hugh_lover- 09-24-2008
---House's quiet relationship/talks with the patient harkens back to shows like the Pilot, Control, Damned If You Do, Babies & Bathwater, and Kids, not to mention Autopsy and several 2nd season shows. House may not like patients, but he is honest with them and can talk to them without verbally abusing them. It's been awhile since we've since House like this. I can't recall any of these moments in season 4, except for Frozen.
I'd say that both "Ugly" and "Guardian Angels" have those moments off hand.
And, by the way, speaking of ugly, I really appreciated the ugliness of Apple's lying to try and get the other patient to have a brain biopsy. It was nasty, it was selfish, and it was absolutely what I think would happen when people are scared they're going to die.
Too short in Ugly, but for whatever reason it was not one of my favorite episodes of S4, but yeah, Guardian Angels did have a pretty solid House-patient scene.
Apple's lying and that whole scene was intense, a very uncomfortable moment for me, but House is at its best when it makes me feel uncomfortable.
Also, for those of you who thought her eyesight was only 20/200 I'm fairly sure that it was stated as: 20/2000!
NightOwl- 09-24-2008
Also, for those of you who thought her eyesight was only 20/200 I'm fairly sure that it was stated as: 20/2000!
No, she definitely says, "twenty two-hundred vision," as in 20/200.
Poeia- 09-24-2008
Okay, legally blind is 20/200 or worse with the best corrective lenses possible. It doesn't refer to uncorrected vision.
So, Olivia, Verb et al, with glasses Apple's vision was the same as yours is without your glasses on.
filex1410- 09-24-2008
Anyway, I wasn't trying to figure out which secret would be THE MOST devastating to Wilson's career; I was simply expressing a desire to know all his secrets. Because Wilson is mysterious, and I like him. Mainly, that line about secrets was meant to indicate intimacy between House and Wilson. Close friends know each other's secrets. That's all. And I was expressing excitement over that.
Sorry I didn't get that from your original post. I thought you were saying you didn't know any of his secrets. I don't like to assume and people can forget from 2 years back. My misunderstanding.
I agree the line was meant to indicate intimacy but grouped in with no more trust to breach, having him followed and calling him names I think it was also meant perhaps as a warning that there is no telling what House might do next so it was also at least momentarily a bit scary.
If House tells a secret, like the one we all know about Grace, that devastates Wilson's career then his life is damaged too. Perhaps the way at the time House feels his life and career (no more epiphanies on demand) are being damaged by what Wilson was doing to him by refusing to talk and moving on.
Hugh_lover- 09-24-2008
Okay, legally blind is 20/200 or worse with the best corrective lenses possible. It doesn't refer to uncorrected vision.
So, Olivia, Verb et al, with glasses Apple's vision was the same as yours is without your glasses on.
Okay, so they could only correct her vision to 20/200. I'm 20/400 and consider myself fairly blind without my glasses on. That makes sense. Thanks.
Forumer™ is Voted #1 Free Forum Hosting provider
Build your own community today with the largest message board hosting company.