Okay, well being on the west coast sucks. I have yet to read through the five pages of posts yet, so sorry if this is redundant (and I'm sure it will be)... I think for the first time ever, I LIKED Cameron. Holy smokes, I never thought I'd say that. The ending was powerful, and my heart broke with what Wilson said (my heart hurt for both of them. They're both hurting in their own way.), but it's what House said just prior to that that really got to me...about dying changes everything, but that almost dying changes nothing. Wow. Good POTW. I liked Chase...but not enough of him. Loved Kutner. 13...well, I expect that they're going to deal with her diagnosis. It's not like she has the flu, so I was okay with it. Not my favorite storyline, but it can't last forever (right?!). And House himself...wow. This is a different House. And Cuddy was right; he was afraid Wilson would leave if he opened up. And he did. ETA...should mention that I agree that Wilson needed to say what he said and House needed to hear it. Also meant to add that LE is amazing, honestly. Loved every scene she was in.

Okay, wow.... *wipes the tears from my eyes so I can see to type* I thought this episode was brilliant from start to finish, and while spoilers about how heavy it was on Thirteen's issues made me apprehensive, I actually loved her in this. My first thoughts on House were that he seemed exceptionally hard and bitter, moreso than usual, and I knew it was all defense... He's more vulnerable than usual, and therefore must appear to be *less* vulnerable... I loved Cuddy's attempts to reconcile them, and I disagreed with Foreman's assessment that it was purely for selfish reasons. Yes, her life gets harder if Wilson goes, but I think she genuinely cares about both of them -- as I think is oddly evidenced by her "Go to hell" comment to Wilson. I think his remarks assigning selfish motives to her efforts was so offensive and hurtful to her as to make her respond that way. I liked the scene with Cameron, I felt like this was an appropriate time to reference her loss, and she didn't annoy me as she usually does... I actually think she could be good for Wilson during this time... I actually wasn't angry at Wilson at all this episode, though I expected to be. I felt sympathy for him from the start, because he was cool, distant, with House, but wasn't being deliberately hurtful. Judging from the last scene, as well as the scenes before it between him and House, it seems to me like he feels like he's so deeply entrenched in this unhealthy, codependent relationship that in order to break the cycle and stop enabling, stop feeding his own addiction to being needed -- he has to just get away completely. I think he feels like he couldn't stay and try to change things, because they'd inevitably fall back into their same patterns. House had one line that made me cringe, because I think for Wilson it only served to seal his decision. When House gave him his pager and Wilson made the comment, "You have to do what's right for you, and I have to do what's right for me" and House said "But I'm better at it" Gah!!! He couldn't have said a worse thing. All that served to do was to prove the point Wilson had already come to. I feel like there was a lot of truth to Wilson's ending monologue, although it was painful. He's been enabling House for years now, and ultimately, it's not good for either of them. I think that he will inevitably come back to a place where they can be friends, but for now, it's probably good for House to have to stand on his own for a while. Addicts will take and take and take, and make no efforts to solve their problem, as long as someone is there making it easy and comfortable for them to do so. Sometimes the only thing that will help them to change is to have that support system pulled out from under them. This did utterly break my heart, and yes, I wanted to hold both House and Wilson and make it all better - but it's going to take time, and I'm looking forward to the whole long, detailed, painful, angsty, beautiful process!! :) Edited by Fid to remove stray tags

If Hugh finally wins the long deserved Emmy this Sunday, I say we start a petition to get him the Stanley Cup and the Heisman Trophey as well. He's got to dance and skate and fake left, right and center as a means of acting around the complete deadwood that is 13 threatening to suck all the life out of this show. Seriously, someone is going to have to sit me down and explain to me like I'm a three year old, why she is getting storylines that are approaching a trampling point of stepping all over House's storylines. She's the tragic victim, the feminist warrior, the bitchy co-worker, the stern lecturer, all while undoubtedly "the one who cares." She was fucking Sybil in this episode. Perhaps I could overlook all of this if 13 were an enjoyable character. But she isn't. She's really a drag. And, as depicted, she's kind of a lousy person. I was glad the POTW went back to her old job. (Regardless of the fact of the legalities of her losing her job to begin with. That was a plot hole a mile wide.) 13's instant summary of what kind of person, what kind of boss the POTW's employer was rubbed me entirely wrong. It's clunky writing to be sure, but OW just can't swing with the contradictions of this character. It is absolutely beyond her skill set. I kept thinking of the metaphor of the bird winging it up there to be near those that soar. OW's barely hanging in there next to Hugh. It's embarassing. For her and for the show. Other than that, I thought there were scenes in this episode that absolutely rocked. Everything with House and Wilson worked. That last scene so, so painful and while I can rationalize where Wilson is coming from (especially as he recognized his own enabling in the past) I could help but ache for House. Cuddy and House totally worked. Cuddy never really goes far enough as an administrator for me---especially when patient care is at stake--but at least she put a kibosh on House's juvenile hiding methods. House and Cameron worked and Wilson and Cameron worked. I was very glad to see a return of the unique relationship that Cameron and Wilson have always had, sometimes on screen, sometimes off. They've always seemed like two people who could be friends even without House as a middle person. (Which isn't something I could say about Wilson and Cuddy, for example.) Chase? Ruled. Not enough screen time but the very fact that he got to say that he hated working on visitor's day rocked hard. The newbies still aren't cohesive to me as a team or as a center faction of the show. I don't buy that they have any camraderie or chemistry whatsoever with each other. Foreman seems like a strange uncle at this point. Not sure what the plan is with him but he's utterly useless in his current role and, indeed, has been for all of season 4. To reiterate an oft mentioned gripe: I don't think this show will fully work until they figure their cast out. Having half the cast stand around with little to do while someone (other than House) gets the spotlight until it's their turn does not interesting drama make. The show will work in bits and pieces, to be sure, but as a cohesive finished product? Probably not. Let's hope they get that sorted. Until then, Hugh should also get some sort of gold medal for rhythmic gymnastics.

dreamsofspike wrote: House had one line that made me cringe, because I think for Wilson it only served to seal his decision. When House gave him his pager and Wilson made the comment, "You have to do what's right for you, and I have to do what's right for me" and House said "But I'm better at it" What House said is, "Yea, but it comes easier for me." Yeah, I couldnt remember the exact line, but just the gist of it :P And still, suuuuuch the wrong thing to say at that moment :-S

Not much to add, but I do like the notion of Hugh winning a gold for rhythmic gymnastics. Hell, he probably could! Teared up at the ending and thought wow: This implies that Wilson never actually liked House, that he just let him think he did out of kindness and now that has run out. It was quite a twist that he walked out on House not because of Amber but because of him. "You should have been on that bus alone." How does he say that to another human being? I don't hate Wilson, but man, he can be much harsher than House. And he knows how vulnerable House is. HL saying nothing and standing stock still was so powerful. RSL great as well. Agree on the rest of the cast: too much 13, Cuddy fine (I thought her "go to hell" to Wilson was appropriate since he had just asked her to be on his side against House: she's trying to get them to talk to each other, not gang up on House.) Chase good with good lines, Cameron decent, others ok. Mostly though, not enough House, though I hope Hugh got some well-deserved rest.

I think Wilson blows. Not sure if he was ever House's friend. House should risk his life and mind for his sake more often. He's so full of it. If you really care for someone you don't switch it off. Chase rocked. HL totaly rocked. More Hugh less 13.

I found the episode thought-provoking, extremely well-acted (duh!) and quite touching. What more could I want -- besides a lot fewer commercials and four breaks instead of six -- out 47 minutes of my life? SPOILER------ Am I the only one who remembers the promo that hinted (strongly) that 13 and POW had been "together," as it were? Perhaps that's why she was so involved with the case... and in the show/canon, we've now been deprived of that backstory. If that's the case, someone made an unfortunate editing choice at the last minute. Or is that the promo for next week? In which case, forget I said anything. ----END SPOILER Mod Note: Promos are spoilers here. If you haven't seen it on screen yet, chances are that it's not a question of bad editing, but the fact that the episode hasn't aired yet. If you have ANY question about it, SPOILER TAG IT. The scenario you are discussing happens in, I believe, Episode 5. So, is Wilson worse or House? Depends on what day it is. We all knew going into this episode it was a screwed-up friendship. The only difference now is that Wilson, in a completely understandable way, has convinced himself that it's not actually a friendship -- it's just screwed up. And he has, unfortunately, done it in the worst possible way for House, confirming for him that when he does, indeed, open up, he'll get very very hurt. If Wilson had been a tad more honest earlier in the episode, House would still have gotten hurt, but not as badly, because he would still have had his guard up. He was so sure that Wilson hated him that he spent much of the episode on the defense. Then, when Wilson finally said he didn't hate House, the guard fell. And that's when Wilson got honest. Ouchie. Maybe the problem is that every time Wilson tries consciously to protect House... or "fix" him... that's when he hurts him the most. In a way, it's like House and the drugs. On the drugs, House's pain is manageable and he's able to do his job. Off the drugs, he nearly cuts a little girl in half. When he's enabling House, Wilson actually has someone to spend time with -- a friend -- and he encourages some of House's better traits. Trying not to enable House (Detox, Meaning, Merry Little Christmas, and now this one), the main thing he succeeds in doing is hurting someone who is at his most vulnerable. Ooooh. Just had a thought. Do you suppose that Wilson was already going through some of this thought process before Amber's death? That part of his separation from House was not just because he was involved with Amber, but because he was purposely pulling himself away from House? I ask only because it occurred to me that if that was the case, maybe that's why House (who can be remarkably sensitive) was all alone drinking in a bar in the middle of the afternoon. At least that's how I see everything right this minute. Tomorrow, I may see it all very differently. In short: Screwed up on both sides. Both of them are emotionally repressed, but in different ways. Both of them do terribly, unconscionably hurtful things to each other. And both of them have been there for each other when it mattered. Sometimes. And in this episode, both of them are hurting. A lot. Boffle wrote: Teared up at the ending and thought wow: This implies that Wilson never actually liked House, that he just let him think he did out of kindness and now that has run out. In other words, he was friends with House only out of pity... the one thing House has fought desperately against allowing anyone to feel for him. And now, he finds House so completely pathetic he doesn't even have pity left. I love both characters, but sometimes I think Wilson can be astoundingly cruel... and he seems oblivious to the fact that he is. Oooh. Just realized I had two posts in a row. Didn't mean to. Mod note: Simply edit your previous post to add this info to it in the future.

Ooooh. Just had a thought. Do you suppose that Wilson was already going through some of this thought process before Amber's death? That part of his separation from House was not just because he was involved with Amber, but because he was purposely pulling himself away from House? I ask only because it occurred to me that if that was the case, maybe that's why House (who can be remarkably sensitive) was all alone drinking in a bar in the middle of the afternoon. I think this is actually highly likely, especially judging from some of wilson's behavior toward the end of season 4. I feel like if he's being honest and it's not about what happened with amber, this would have to be something he'd thought long and hard about, and it would have to be based on more than just one random, tragic -- yet accidental -- event.

"You should have been on that bus alone." I think - and this is just the way I understood it - that what Wilson was saying was that House shouldn't have called for a ride in the first place, or that having received the call, Amber (or Wilson) should have just told him to take a cab or the bus instead of continuing to enable him (ie: the middle of the night phone calls). What gave me hope in this episode was Wilson repeating what Amber told him - that he needs to look after himself. I'm hoping the writers continue to remember that and that any reconciliation has as its basis Wilson coming to an understanding of how House is good for him.